Brake modification

[JDM_virgin]

I know most of you on here run skyline brake setups or k sports (or something similar), but I was wondering if anyone had spaced out the stock calipers in order to fit bigger rotors.

I cant really justify an expensive brake upgrade as wont be using the car on track but I do want sharper brakes as the ones on my mk7 fiesta seem to be more responsive haha. I will go down the road of yellow stuff pads and braided lines to start with but have thought about making a bracket up to move the caliper out from the original mounts in order to take larger rotors off a skyline or 300zx maybe (I think they are 325 ish?). This should be reasonably straight forward should it not?

 

[2fst4u]

They already make them. They're called dog bone brackets (or calliper spacers)

 

[Clarkey]

Yep really popular mod, db-power did them but are in the process of closing down now, check out their section on sxoc.

BTW, Z32 have only 280mm discs, 296mm are in R32 GTR. R33/34 GTS.

 

[nissan240]

Not to derail this thread but it pertains to brakes....

Will 300zx Pads work with s15 calipers? i know the rotors are the same.

 

[JDM_virgin]

Yep really popular mod, db-power did them but are in the process of closing down now, check out their section on sxoc.

BTW, Z32 have only 280mm discs, 296mm are in R32 GTR. R33/34 GTS.

cheers for the help guys, I have seen complete brake kits with the brackets but they're with 345 disc which is complete over kill. Yeah I did some reading and found the 300zx discs are 280. I will probably try and get some good quality 34 gtr discs as they are 316mm. Does anyone know if any of the skyline discs are the same thickness as the s15 oem brakes as I don't fancy splitting/machining the caliper.

also going to fit braided lines and green stuff pads as I don't think I will get the yellow ones up to temperature for them to work properly on the road

 

[S15_SAM]

Ebc suck! Get some hawk pads, or ferrodo ds2500 track pads. Not cheap but are very good!

Subaru early 4 pot pads are the same and 300zx will work too.

Upgrading the flexi hoses and a brake master cylinder stopper will help abit. The big brake kits are best bang for your buck or upgrading the master cylinder to a larger one will help with response.

R34 discs are too wide I think.

 

[JDM_virgin]

But I'm not tracking the car so a big brake kit is pointless because I'm never going to get them hot enough to warrant the extra cooling they provide. Plus 6 or 8 pots are not necessary for road use. And also track pads are again designed to work at medium to high temperatures and will be **** when cold which is when I'm goin to need them 99% of the time. I've never used EBC pads but if you say they're pants I will do some reading on them

Shame the 34's are too wide, are the gts discs the same width do you know? Tbh I don't actually know how thick the oem disc are.

 

[S15_SAM]

I researched it all ages ago and can't remember off the top of my head of the sizes. (Should really write all the research down)

The big brake kits give great response upgrades, as the caliper is stopping the disc further out towards the edge of the rotating mass. Therefor the same clamping force equals better braking. With the added bonus of cooler discs.
The DB power kits use an BMW M3 disc redrilled to 5x114 and caliper spacing brackets so the stock caliper can be used.

as you say 6/8 pots are over kill for the road on a stockish power car (it would e nice to have them though)

the hawk pads are ferro carbon material and therefor bite harder and last longer even from cold. And on eBay are only 84quid. http://bit.ly/1pl8G0t

Trouble with buying bigger nissan discs is that the caliper will still have to be spaced and will cost more maybe? Unless you got access to tools!

 

[JDM_virgin]

Yeah I know what you mean about the caliper being further out etc as the moment of force is stronger etc that's why I want to space the caliper out using a bracket. A brand new set of skyline discs are only about 150 and I can make the bracket at work and just lock the brakes to keep the caliper on the disc then make myself a template like that. In a ideal world it would be great to have monster stoppers but by doing that I then need to upgrade the BMC which is just more hassle for a problem that never needed to be solved lol.

I think this setup will be perfect for what I want- extra bite and brake feel as they seem numb at the moment but I guess my little fezza is 15 years it's junior! I will have a look at those pads as if they work good from cold an you've used and recommend them then will defo have a look

 

[dave_t]

Ebc suck!

Woah! I love EBC Yellow Stuff, which i have on my S15 all round. Iv'e used them on my Old Yaris T-Sport and Integra dc2 and i have never found a downside to them. You do need slotted discs to keep them from glazing over though, never use them on blank discs. Take a little heating up, but once they are up to temperature they are great - i have never got them to fade as much as ive tried.

 

[S15_SAM]

That may be one reason why I've never rated them, plain discs!

The yellows are much more track focused, but the greens are decidedly average! I think for the money there are better pads nowadays! Carbon or ceramic pads are alot better and more affordable now!

 

[JDM_virgin]

Db power doing 330mm brake kit for 220 have emailed them but also want to find out where to get replacement rotors as I don't wanna buy the kit then can't get new discs because they've gone under lol. Gtr discs on their own were 190 so this kit seems good value- only thing won't ever be able to use my stock wheels ever again :'( lol

 

[dave_t]

Yes that must be noted, you do have to warm the yellowstuff up to perform well. 5 Minutes into your journey and they are pretty much up to temperature.

The only time i have tried greenstuff is on my first car, a 106 Quiksilver (dont laugh) and i saw no difference to the oem pads. they actually felt like they got worse after a couple of weeks. was this because they were on blank discs and they just glazed over?

The first time i had used yellowstuff was on my DC2 and it came with them fitted, with oem blank discs. After a night of hard driving my friend driving with me noticed the discs were glowing, i was amazed as i hadnt noticed any fade at all!

On advice from a friend of mine i went for slotted discs, as he did a lot of track days, he said the slots will keep the pads from glazing, which makes sense when you think about it. It was a Brilliant setup.

Then i had that Yaris T-Sport (posted it up before) which had slotted discs and yellowstuff pads and maybe because it was so lightweight, but it just stopped like no other car lol. Amazing.

For the S15 i was open to trying something new with the K-Sport calipers, but from reading up and talking to people who ran k-sports on various cars, EBC Yellowstuff were near the top of the list. And like i said, they have been fantastic on the S15, K-Sport up front - Z32 at the rear.

 

[dave_t]

Db power doing 330mm brake kit for 220 have emailed them but also want to find out where to get replacement rotors as I don't wanna buy the kit then can't get new discs because they've gone under lol. Gtr discs on their own were 190 so this kit seems good value- only thing won't ever be able to use my stock wheels ever again :'( lol

The main reason i opted NOT to try these DB Power adapter kit's is because the oem front AND rear calipers are prone to seizing. One rear was sticking on mine, and when i sold my front calipers to a friend of mine after upgrading to K-Sport, within 2 months one had seized on him. It really is worth upgrading the Calipers, will saves time and money in the long run.

Second hand K-Sport setups pop up all the time on sxoc and driftworks, keep an eye out!

 

[Auss15]

^^^^ I'm with this lad, see if you can find a second hand set of bigger calipers and rotors...The stock units will sieze up and the only benefit of bigger rotors will be cooling. The contact patch will still be the same so you wont get any extra braking. I would rebuild the stock calipers, put in some decent pads like the Ferodo DS2500 and good slotted rotors. I did many tack days with this setup before I want to Brembos and had very good braking combined with using Motul RBF 600 brake fluid

 

[JDM_virgin]

^^^^ I'm with this lad, see if you can find a second hand set of bigger calipers and rotors...The stock units will sieze up and the only benefit of bigger rotors will be cooling. The contact patch will still be the same so you wont get any extra braking. I would rebuild the stock calipers, put in some decent pads like the Ferodo DS2500 and good slotted rotors. I did many tack days with this setup before I want to Brembos and had very good braking combined with using Motul RBF 600 brake fluid

The contact patch is irrelevant- the fact that the caliper is further out from the center of the wheel will create more of a stopping force. Plus if the brakes are too good on the front it will properly unbalance the car and then it will handle like a bag of ****e and make the rear end go light.

 

[meddler]

An easy upgrade is the R32GTR disks and calipers. Direct bolt on, no spacers. They are 296mm instead of 280mm and the calipers are cast alloy not iron which is about double the weight. Probably not as good as other options but they are comparatively very cheap.

 

[Clarkey]

Back to pads, I've used EBC green and yellow on my BMW. Greens suck, not even 2 laps of Donington national before they are gone, I think OEM pads are better than these. Yellows are pretty good though, I'd say the ideal road pad, work great from cold and have really good stopping power. Will last a 20 min stint on Donington nat with full on last of the late brakers punishment, the pedal goes soft when they are really hot though. Only last a couple of full on hot laps at Oulton though, the braking into hislops is too much. I changed to a mintex full racing type pad and they are awful, no modulation when cold and love to lock wheels and the squeal is horrendous.

What I will also say is that when making changes to the front, always take measures to balance out the change at the rear. If the brake balance is on the piss then you could end up with worse braking than you started with, this is my experience.

 

[JDM_virgin]

An easy upgrade is the R32GTR disks and calipers. Direct bolt on, no spacers. They are 296mm instead of 280mm and the calipers are cast alloy not iron which is about double the weight. Probably not as good as other options but they are comparatively very cheap.

will i need a 32 BMC or is the OEM one man enough?

Back to pads, I've used EBC green and yellow on my BMW. Greens suck, not even 2 laps of Donington national before they are gone, I think OEM pads are better than these. Yellows are pretty good though, I'd say the ideal road pad, work great from cold and have really good stopping power. Will last a 20 min stint on Donington nat with full on last of the late brakers punishment, the pedal goes soft when they are really hot though. Only last a couple of full on hot laps at Oulton though, the braking into hislops is too much. I changed to a mintex full racing type pad and they are awful, no modulation when cold and love to lock wheels and the squeal is horrendous.

What I will also say is that when making changes to the front, always take measures to balance out the change at the rear. If the brake balance is on the piss then you could end up with worse braking than you started with, this is my experience.

Green stuff pads are for fast road use not track use so no wonder they faded- also with ebc pads if you don't use grooved discs they will glaze and again cause brake fade. If youre giving your brakes hell then red stuff pads are probably what you want for the track.

 

[dave_t]

Back to pads, I've used EBC green and yellow on my BMW. Greens suck, not even 2 laps of Donington national before they are gone, I think OEM pads are better than these. Yellows are pretty good though, I'd say the ideal road pad, work great from cold and have really good stopping power. Will last a 20 min stint on Donington nat with full on last of the late brakers punishment, the pedal goes soft when they are really hot though. Only last a couple of full on hot laps at Oulton though, the braking into hislops is too much. I changed to a mintex full racing type pad and they are awful, no modulation when cold and love to lock wheels and the squeal is horrendous.

What I will also say is that when making changes to the front, always take measures to balance out the change at the rear. If the brake balance is on the piss then you could end up with worse braking than you started with, this is my experience.

That's odd - very different to how i find my Yellowstuff pads. i find them not good from cold, take 5 minutes of driving to get them up to temp, but then no fade when hot, extensive hard driving on the street,track and Nurburgring and i have never experienced fade at all. What brake setup do you run?
Your experience of fade could be to do with brake fluid maybe?

The contact patch is irrelevant- the fact that the caliper is further out from the center of the wheel will create more of a stopping force. Plus if the brakes are too good on the front it will properly unbalance the car and then it will handle like a bag of ****e and make the rear end go light.

Good point about balance - I have to say when i fitted the K-Sports up front, although they were miles better than the oem setup, the pedal feel wasnt great, the ABS was quite intrusive, it didnt feel quite right.

I then fitted a Z32 BM57 Master Cylinder and a Z32/R33 Rear brake setup, also with Yellowstuff pads, and MOTUL Race spec fluid, now the pedal feel and balance is perfect, and you sometimes forget you have ABS as it rarely needs to step in.

For either spirited street driving or track driving, i feel this setup is necessary - Having good brakes give your the confidence to push, and make the most of the great chassis. Best mod on the car IMO